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W124Club.nl • 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power : Techniek
Pagina 1 van 1

300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: wo jan 08, 2020 6:11 pm
door Stofzuigerman
Mn trouwe wagentje( met automaatbak) heeft t ( soms ) niet zo naar zn zin.
300TE m103 uit 1987.

Moest bij stoplicht wachten, motor liep gewoon netjes, gaf gas en kwam niet van zn plek.
Motor begon gewoon erg slecht te lopen ( bijna af te slaan ) en geen enkele power.
Kon motor wel aan de praat houden ( zette de automaatbak in neutraal en liep weer keurig stationair)
Weer in versnelling, gas geven en weer deed ie zo raar.
Voorzichtig gas blijven geven en opeens kon iktoch weer normaal wegrijden.
En dit gebeurde ( soms maar niet altijd ) bij stoplichten.

Merkte nu ook bij rijden op cruisecontrol dat motor soms heel ietsjes en eventjes raar schokte en meteen weer normaal doordraaide..

Tja, waar begin je dan met zoeken : nokkenassensor los geschroefd, bleek vervuild, schoongemaakt en de motor liep hierna onwijs mooi stationair. Er zat voorheen wel eens een heel klein en licht schokje/schommeltje in het stationair toerental.

Leek even goed te zijn... maar toch weer niet.

Misschien brandstof gerommel ofzo : nieuwe benzinepomp, benzinefilter en kleine wartel met ingebouwde zeefje bij spinnekop vervangen......geen verschil.

Hmmm: rotor en verdelerkap ? : Deze zijn van Bosch en hebben hooguit 15000 km gedraaid. Rotor schoongemaakt en licht opgeschuurd en puntjes in verdelerdap ook. Motor liep nu opeens heel heel heel erg rot na het weer monteren..grrrrrr.

Had nog een oude originele MB verdelerkap ( ook met weinig km gedraaid ) liggen...gemonteerd en motor liep al stuk beter dan met de Bosch kap alleen toch nog steeds niet goed.

Ga ik nu een testrondje rijden in de wijk dan loopt de motor erg slecht : geen power, horten stoten oftewel eigenlijk niet te doen. Stationair loopt ie nou opeens wel stuk hoger met starten( 1200 toeren ) . Iets warmer zakt toeren naar 500 en gooit ie m meteen weer hoger zodat ie niet afslaat. Dit laatste is dus sinds de oude originele MB verdelerkap erop zit

Zag nu wel dat een Vacuümslang afgebroken was die onder het luchtfilterhuis loopt. Gaat vanuit een rubber slang, die loopt van het luchtfilterhuis naar het motorblok en dan onder filterhuis door naar ?? Heb vacuumslangetje met tape maar even weer aan elkaar gemaakt.

Wat is wijsheid : bestel ik toch eerst een nieuwe Bosch set rotor & verdeler ( en Vacuümslang vervangen ) of kan ik nog naar iets anders kijken eerst ??

Groet,

Paul

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: wo jan 08, 2020 8:01 pm
door Merida
Hallo Paul,

Vacuüm lekkage (valse lucht) is natuurlijk wel een hele, hele grote boosdoener. Of je dat met een stukje tape redt.....ben benieuwd als je nu onder de kap kijkt, of het nog goed zit?
Dat zeker- en vooral goed, oplossen is een must!

Verder die verdeelkap is wel een raar verhaal. Hoe heb je die contact stiften schoon gemaakt, krabber met een schroevendraaier of ben je met een stuk schuurpapier in de weer geweest? De kap is van binnen ook geïsoleerd; kan je dat beschadigt hebben?
Mooie test voor een verdeelkap is; eraf halen (kabels gewoon laten zitten) en op z'n kop leggen. Even in hijgen, erin kijken en iemand laten starten; de koolstift mag dan geen vonken in het rond sturen.
Over de koolstift; zit die nog goed? Kap zit (of zat, nu je hem gewisseld hebt) ook goed? Klinkt misschien wat betuttelend, maar ik ben toch wel rare dingen tegen gekomen ;)

Kijk ook eens naar de kabels. Even met een plantenspuit wat water erover en -liefst in het donker- laten lopen; kijkgoed of je vonken ziet lopen.

Verder, helaas, kunnen het nog 1001 dingen zijn, maar dit is -zoals ik het probleem lees- echt even de basis. Als dat allemaal goed is, kijken we verder als het ware.

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: do jan 09, 2020 7:34 am
door JantjeV8
Vergeet de bougies niet. Het overspanningsrelais kan lelijk doen.

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: do jan 09, 2020 11:55 pm
door Stofzuigerman
Dank voor het meedenken !!!

Vacuümslang =v vandaag vervangen met een origineel MB slangetje en geeft geen verschil.

Van t weekend ga ik verder met voor de zekerheid bougies vervangen ( OVP is vorig jaar vernieuwd ) en verdelerkap nakijken. Kabels zouden goed moeten zijn : vorig jaar vervangen ( Bosch ) maar zal ze controleren.

Bosch kap had ik alleen de contactpuntjes licht opgeschuurd trouwens .

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: vr jan 10, 2020 12:38 am
door Merida
Zoals jij al je werkzaamheden beschreef, nam ik eigenlijk aan dat je de bougie's als één van de eersten wel gedaan had?
Gebeurt niet vaak dat ze "zomaar" stuk gaan en het vervolgens wel/niet/wel doen, maar een paar verse erin zal zeker geen kwaad kunnen!

Een kabel zou inderdaad niet na een jaar door moeten slaan......maarrrrrr.......controleren kan geen kwaad ;) Ik heb er zelf best vaak last van en zelfs met een a-merk (weet nu even niet meer welke dat waren) op erg korte termijn (anderhalf/twee jaar) eens gehad. Dus zeg nooit "nooit".

Was ik nog vergeten, maar even verder kijken voor valse lucht kan ook geen kwaad, ook op de rubberen onderzijde van je "spinnenkop" voor als het droog mocht zijn en ingescheurd?
Even bij Action een spuitbusje remmen reiniger halen en spuiten als de motor stationair loopt op de zaken die zouden kunnen lekken:
- rubber afdichting van de injectoren
- spruitstuk pakking
- langs aansluitingen
enzovoorts.
Mocht er lekkage zijn, verandert het toerental. Bijna altijd omhoog, 99 van de 100 keer.

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: vr jan 10, 2020 1:41 pm
door BobKoppert
Mijn advies; gebruik voor ontsteking altijd nieuwe (Bosch) delen, ook kunststof verouderd, wordt na verloop van tijd hard en broos met alle gevolgen van dien. Ik ben met mijn 300E ooit midden op de weg stil komen staan door een afgebroken rotor, auto werd afgesleept naar de dealer, die heeft toen onder meer de verdelerkap (Bosch) en - uiteraard - de rotor vervangen (Bosch), maar sindsdien liep de motor slecht, sloeg steeds over. Vervolgens, na heel veel vergeefse pogingen een nieuwe Bosch verdelerkap geplaatst, daarna liep motor weer perfect.

Moraal van dit verhaal: blijf Bosch ontstekingsdelen gebruiken voor een 124, maar ook Bosch is geen 100% garantie dat je geen problemen ondervindt. Ik zou zeker voor nieuwe onderdelen gaan vwb de ontsteking.

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: vr jan 10, 2020 4:57 pm
door klaasCA
Gelijkaardige problemen gehad met mijn SE260 (M103 motor uit 86): vermogenverlies & stilvallen bij stoplicht ed. Vervangen van rotor & verdeler (Bosch) heeft dit opgelost.
Moet wel zeggen dat de contactpunten van rotor en verdeler er erg slecht aan toe waren, vervangen was noodzakelijk. Geen idee hoe lang de oude rotor & verdeler er al op zaten.

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: do jan 23, 2020 2:42 pm
door BenzMercedes
W124 benzine motoren lopen het mooist op euro 98. Wanneer je euro 95 tankt (E10) en de EZL-aanslag staat op S gaat ie ook niet soepel lopen. Gasklep gecheckt? Was bij mij een veertje los....;-)

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: za jan 25, 2020 2:49 pm
door Blauwe Hap
Euro 95 (octaan 95, met 5% (E5) of nu meestal 10% (E10) ethanol) is ook Super benzine. Stekker op S. Octaan 98 (E5) heet in Nederland SuperPlus oid. In oa Duitsland vind je ook nog "Normaal" met een RON octaangehalte van 91. Dan moet de stekker op N.

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: wo feb 05, 2020 5:49 pm
door Stofzuigerman
Update :

Bougies waren pik en pik zwart en verkoolt bleek bij vervangen.
Gekeken en getest of er ergens bij een slang valse lucht was en dat is niet zo

Tankte altijd 95 maar sinds t E10 is nu altijd 98 en schakelaartje onder de motorkap staat inderdaad op S

Nieuwe rotor en verdelerkap besteld via Ebay ( Bosch en samen nog geen € 100 !!) maar dat maakt dus geen verschil.

Bij vervangen van kap en rotor vandaag hoorde ik de KLR ( Kalt Lauf Reglung ) erg gulzig naar lucht happen.
Opgezocht op het interweb en las hoe je die kan afdoppen. Dikke slang bij de regelaar lostrekken en afgedopt.

Motor liep daarna werkelijk waar als een zonnetje en probleemloos.... zo heeft ie nog nooit gelopen.

Moet vanavond nog een stukje op pad en zal kijken hoe t dan gaat.

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: wo feb 05, 2020 9:41 pm
door Merida
Fijn dat het is opgelost!

Ondertussen merk ik wel dat het verhaal van die schakelaar een heel eigen leven gaat leiden; het wordt zelfs ingezet (goedbedoeld) als "iets wat het slechte lopen kan verklaren".
Dat is dus niet zo!
Dat wil ik wel graag stellen hier; ook voor mensen die dit topic of forum gebruiken om hun storing op te zoeken/te onderzoeken.

De schakelaar op "N" geeft iets minder voorontsteking in de meeste gebieden (belasting tegen toerental).
Heel zwart wit mag je stellen dat je met wat meer voorontsteking, iets meer vermogen hebt en iets zuiniger rijdt.
Dat zijn hele kleine beetjes waar wij normaal gesproken niets van merken. Ook het verbruik; haal twee keer je voet wat eerder van het pedaal als je een stoplicht ziet en het verbruik is ook net zo ver.

Het is dus NIET zo, dat als je hem in "N" hebt staan terwijl je 98 tankt, dat je hortend en stotend, rokend en met een verbruik van 1:1 rondrijdt(!)
Motor zou ook gewoon prima lopen.

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: do feb 06, 2020 1:58 pm
door klaasCA
Vraagje : zit die KLR op elke M103?
En hoe ziet de er precies uit?
Evt link naar instructies voor afdoppen posten?

Mvg
Klaas

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: do feb 06, 2020 4:00 pm
door Stofzuigerman
Hier link naar KLR en afdoppen.

http://forum.mb124.de/read.php?1,867966,867966

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: wo mei 13, 2020 2:09 pm
door Stofzuigerman
Klr afdoppen hielp slechts eventjes. Heb ik nog wel steeds afgedopt omdat motor sowieso rot looot met die aangesloten.

Bougiekabels ( Bosch ) van nog geen 2 jaar bleken corrosie in de kabel te hebben. De metalen dop die op de bougie klikt zit met een soort schroefverbinding aan de kabel gemonteerd ( in de rubber huls) en daar zat de corrosie. Maar keertje Beru besteld en dat leek goed te werken. Had bougies vervangen , echter hadden ze niet BP6EFS gegeven maar de versie met R erin. Vermoedelijk in de vluggigheid niet goed gekeken bij pakken. Die met R erin zorden dus ook voor rottigheid en nu zitten wel erin.

Motor loopt nu ene keer goed en volgende keer : met warme motor vooral, als je gas geeft na stoppen of bijna stoppen dan gebeurt er eigenlijk niks : gas reageert niet en motor begint vaak heel erg rot te lopen en slaat af. Bij stationair gaan toeren ook wel opeens zomaar omhoog naar 1000 rpm en als je dan gas geeft dan reageert motor bijna niet. Na paar keer flink gassen pakt ie wel weer met horten en stoten en zwarte rook uit de uitlaat.

Laatst Anwb moeten bellen omdat ie uitviel en helemaal niet meer wilde starten. Met Anwb erbij wilde ie wel opeens weer en kon ik toch thuis komen. Anwb vermoed iets met gasklep.

Heeft een van jullie ervaring met de sensor op de gasklep ? Klinkt t plausibel dat mn probleem in die hoek zit?

Kan geen Vacuümlek ontdekken overigens onder de motorkap.

Of weten jullie een m103 kenner in Den Haag en omgeving voor me?

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: do mei 14, 2020 10:57 am
door Shostakovich124

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: do mei 14, 2020 11:01 pm
door Shostakovich124

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: vr mei 15, 2020 9:07 pm
door Shostakovich124

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: zo mei 17, 2020 6:55 pm
door Stofzuigerman
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20200514_144318.jpg
20200514_144318.jpg (2.23 MiB) 1114 keer bekeken


Ik bedoelde niet de lmm maar de sensor op de foto.

Lmm heb ik gemeten en die reageert zoals ik in documentatie kan vinden.

Heb gasklep vd week vd motor gehaald en schoongemaakt. Geeft geen verschil helaas. Ook die sensor gemeten en die meet prima.

Nullastregelaar nagezien en mee gespeeld: motor scheen beter te lopen als ik deze bedrading loslaat. Heb voor de zekerheid nieuwe in bestelling en rij rond met bedrading eraf. Ene keer rijdt ie goed en dan weer helemaal ruck :)

Ik vind het erg fijn dat jullie zo uitgebreid en serieus reageren mannen

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: di jun 09, 2020 6:48 pm
door Stofzuigerman
Intussen ook vernieuwd :

Lmm ( via Orion uiteraard )
Nullastregelaar
Bobine.

Maakt geen verschil.

Heb nu ook euvel dat de aux fan - airco fan continue draait. Heb m maar even losgekoppeld. Weet niet of t een losstaand euvel is of niet, zoek ik nog uit.

Start nog steeds lastig, gooit toeren hoog ( 1500-1600 ) maar probeert toeren op bepaald moment wel te laten zakken echter is dat slechts voor 1 a 2 tellen en dan gooit ie t weer hoog. Problemen zijn nog onveranderd dus ook quagasgeven en uitvallen.... grrrrr

Zal temp meters ook doormeten en testen.

Re: 300TE loopt soms slecht/ geen power

BerichtGeplaatst: zo jun 14, 2020 1:00 pm
door Stofzuigerman
Temperatuursensor met 2 aansluitingen vervangen.

Deze zit bovenop het blok ter hoogte van de achterste cilinder/tegen schutbord aan.
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thumb.jpg
thumb.jpg (8.09 KiB) 998 keer bekeken


Motor loopt stuk beter nu. Slaat niet meer af in elk geval en ook geen powerprobleem bij gas geven: kan dus weer zonder angst rijden.

Motor loopt nog wel rommelig ( is denk ik toch iets nog met ontsteking aan de hand ergens) en toerental ligt nog iets te hoog.